22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
- zepplin
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22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
I have been planning this swap for about 18 months now & finally it begins. My decision to go with the V6 rather than the more popular V8 swap was because I beleive that the V8 is too much for the SFA drivtrain in the long run. I also wanted to do what Toyota SA should have done before discontinuing the SFA range. If it was good enough for the Hilux/Surf/Tacoma in the US & Oz, why not here? (So sc%#w them!!!)
My plan all along was to keep the manual gearbox & to do as little damage to the firewall as possible. This meant having to move the motor forward a minimum of 35mm by either fitting a custom bellhousing or moving the gearbox forward. I'm not too fond of welded drivetrain components so I managed to get an original 5VZ FE bellhousing off a manual vehicle in Australia & had a mate bring it over (in his hand luggage nogal!).
This bolts staight onto the motor but does not fit the W56 box in the SFA. So it was either source a R150 box from a KZTE - which would have bolted straight on at both ends - or get it to fit the standard box. Considering the prices of the KZTE box I went the adapter plate route.
The 5VZ bellhousing is already 20mm longer than the standard 22R bellhousing & by having the adapter plate made 30mm thick, I have now moved the motor forward by 50mm without having to massage the firewall or move the gearbox. There were a few complication going this route - input shaft length, clutch fork angle etc. but these have been sorted out. Next challenge was the sump. The standard 5vz sump is towards the front of the motor & would have interfered with the front axle travel so I had to swap it with a sump from a 3vz motor. This sump is towards the rear of the motor & gives sufficient clearance over the axle. The oil pick up & oil splash plate had to be swapped too. These two motors share the same block so no mods needed as the 3VZ parts fitted perfectly. 3VZ top & 5VZ bottom.
With this change, the dipstick also needs to be repositioned. Luckily the 5VZ block already makes provision for this with an existing hole in the casting that is plugged up. Remove plug with a punch from inside & relocate dipstick tube, then re use plug to plug up original dipstick hole.
More to follow.
My plan all along was to keep the manual gearbox & to do as little damage to the firewall as possible. This meant having to move the motor forward a minimum of 35mm by either fitting a custom bellhousing or moving the gearbox forward. I'm not too fond of welded drivetrain components so I managed to get an original 5VZ FE bellhousing off a manual vehicle in Australia & had a mate bring it over (in his hand luggage nogal!).
This bolts staight onto the motor but does not fit the W56 box in the SFA. So it was either source a R150 box from a KZTE - which would have bolted straight on at both ends - or get it to fit the standard box. Considering the prices of the KZTE box I went the adapter plate route.
The 5VZ bellhousing is already 20mm longer than the standard 22R bellhousing & by having the adapter plate made 30mm thick, I have now moved the motor forward by 50mm without having to massage the firewall or move the gearbox. There were a few complication going this route - input shaft length, clutch fork angle etc. but these have been sorted out. Next challenge was the sump. The standard 5vz sump is towards the front of the motor & would have interfered with the front axle travel so I had to swap it with a sump from a 3vz motor. This sump is towards the rear of the motor & gives sufficient clearance over the axle. The oil pick up & oil splash plate had to be swapped too. These two motors share the same block so no mods needed as the 3VZ parts fitted perfectly. 3VZ top & 5VZ bottom.
With this change, the dipstick also needs to be repositioned. Luckily the 5VZ block already makes provision for this with an existing hole in the casting that is plugged up. Remove plug with a punch from inside & relocate dipstick tube, then re use plug to plug up original dipstick hole.
More to follow.
Last edited by zepplin on Mon Dec 19, 2011 6:59 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
This is going to be one of the sexiest SFA's ever when you're finished, Steve! I think that motor will be an ideal match for your SFA and you will have a winner!
Of course, you will be married to it for life, but that can only be a pleasure :)
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Of course, you will be married to it for life, but that can only be a pleasure :)
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
I like what I see.The standard of of that adapter plate is great so I am sure the final result will be of a high standard.Keep us posted.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
Great Job, If You Good You Good
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
Steve, did you manage to get the OEM ecu for it as well?
Worry about the things you can do something about, If you can't don't worry.
Live life to the fullest with no regrets.
Live life to the fullest with no regrets.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
No. Would have been nice though. No too concerned as the motor is from an auto vehicle & when cleaning up the wiring, I noticed a massive amount of plugs & sensors for the auto gearbox. It would have been a huge headache to get it running with the OEM ecu not connected to all the gearbox stuff. Going to go with Dicktator.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
Good luck, I am keen to see what your consumption is going to be with the dictator setup.
Worry about the things you can do something about, If you can't don't worry.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
I'll let you know once it's done. Even if it's the same as the 22R EFI (7 - 8km/l) I'll be a happy bunny.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
I think you are going to get around 5km/l with the dictator. I hope you get more but I got that with the dictator.
Worry about the things you can do something about, If you can't don't worry.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
A mile stone today. Finally got the VZ in for a test fit. The 50mm extra spacing is perfect. Loads of space at the firewall. Will most certainly have to go with a body lift or cut the bonnet. Will still decide.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
Looking very good, Steve. But don't cut the bonnet, try a body lift first.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
I'm with you. On closer inspection it seems I might just get away without doing either but if not, body lift first.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
looking good steve
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
Looking very, very good! If I can give some advise, do a body lift, it is really not so complicated at all. I've done mine some years ago in a days time. But I got everything together before I started. Good luck
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
So laag as moontlik maar so hooeg as nodig............
COG moet laag wees
COG moet laag wees
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Make a deal that no one else thought possible is my aim
Kom wat wil ek bly 'n Bul!
Make a deal that no one else thought possible is my aim
Kom wat wil ek bly 'n Bul!
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
Very nice!!
Jou trokkie gan n klein huisie vol krag he!
Jou trokkie gan n klein huisie vol krag he!
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
Done! Motor in and running sweetly. Drove it for the first time yesterday & will do so around the neighbourhood for the weekend just in case. It did get a little warm on the dyna but that was running the stock 22R radiator - now changed to a aluminium unit from a 2.4D so I'll keep a close eye on it. Relieved that it all fits without a body lift or bonnet trim! A few more small things to get done then I'll post pics of the completed swap.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
Excellent! Now you need to test it on a long run and let it stretch its legs. A long run - say to Klerksdorp and back! ;) Would love to see/hear/drive it!!
-F_D
-F_D
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed!
Well, I do need my radios programmed.........................
Last edited by zepplin on Mon Dec 19, 2011 6:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
Verynice, baie geluk!
Is gebed jou spaarwiel of jou stuurwiel?
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
zepplin wrote:Well, I do need my radios programmed.........................
Now that's a plan!!
;)
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap in progress.
All done :party:
Final dyna run today - 130Kw & 311Nm at the wheels on 31's. Maybe not the best but no contest compared to the 90kw with the 22R.
Now for the consumption tests -
Final dyna run today - 130Kw & 311Nm at the wheels on 31's. Maybe not the best but no contest compared to the 90kw with the 22R.
Now for the consumption tests -
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Congrats, good dyno figures! Just be aware the 5VZ wasn't known for good fuel consumption, if you get around 7-8km/l I say it's very good!
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
I'll be happy with that - what's the 4,0l getting?
Here are some pics.
Here are some pics.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Dit lyk regtig baie netjies.Mooi so
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Well done.Hope to go for test drive soon?
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Nice Steve!! Looks great and the dyno figures looks good. You're going to enjoy that puppy.. Do you really think the V6 ouens are going to tell you their true fuel consumption??
Thys de Jager
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
I wasn't really expecting an answer Thys.
How does that saying go...........something about a pot & a black kettle?????
How does that saying go...........something about a pot & a black kettle?????
Last edited by zepplin on Thu Feb 02, 2012 8:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Does this mean you are going to be testing your vehicle at Bergkraal on the 13 to 15 seeing you missed the Year end GTG?
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
That's the plan unless a last minute contract comes through (as they usually do just when I want to enjoy myself).
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Very nice, that's the ideal dune eater, i am organising a quick trip to atlantis sometime next week, are you game?
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Goodie, looking forward to thatHoppy wrote:Very nice, that's the ideal dune eater, i am organising a quick trip to atlantis sometime next week, are you game?
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Looking really good Steve!
Now for those consumption test figures!
Now for those consumption test figures!
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Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Steve, it looks terrific! One thing concerns me is the distance between the fan and the radiator Are you intending fitting a cowling between fan & radiator?
-F_D
-F_D
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Working on the cowling as we speak but I've just had it out on the road to check the temp & could not get it hotter than 92 deg as it is - fitting the cowling anyway. The big bonus was getting the standard rev counter to now work with the six cylinder. Took me 20 minutes & it is only out by 50rpm @3000.
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
If it's next week I'm in.Hoppy wrote: i am organising a quick trip to atlantis sometime next week,
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Cowling done. A combination of .6 & .8 galvanized plate rivited together.
This has made a big difference in temperature during normal road driving. It was running at 91-92 deg without the cowling & now at 84 deg. I'll test it properly at the dunes on Friday.
This has made a big difference in temperature during normal road driving. It was running at 91-92 deg without the cowling & now at 84 deg. I'll test it properly at the dunes on Friday.
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- The Legend
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Steve
That is a nice job to be proud of.Enjoy it.
That is a nice job to be proud of.Enjoy it.
“A BAD DAYS FISHING IS BETTER THAN A GOOD DAYS WORK”
“Do what you do so well, that the people that see you do it, will want to see you do it again,and will bring others to see you do it”
“Do what you do so well, that the people that see you do it, will want to see you do it again,and will bring others to see you do it”
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- Low Range 4WD
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- Real Name: deane mundy
Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
professional job steve are you going to fit a fan cowling, plenty off folks will be interested in the consumption figures, we have accepted our 22R for what it is, pap en dors
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- Low Range 4WD
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
OK did'nt see there was a second page looks like the boys have been following this one closely start taking orders steve
- Family_Dog
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Looks great, Steve! You know you will now never get rid of that SFA now, don't you? ;)
Wasn't this engine an option in the USA for the model that superseded the SFA, the one not sold here?
-F_D
Wasn't this engine an option in the USA for the model that superseded the SFA, the one not sold here?
-F_D
White Fang: 1999 2.7i DC Raider 4x4
Bull Dog: 1987 4Y-EFI 2.2 DC 4x4
Pra Dog: 1998 Prado VX 3.4
Hound Dog: 2000 2.7i SC 4x4
One Staffie, One Jack Russell, One Ring Neck Screecher, 17 Fish of questionable heritage
- Mud Dog
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- Vehicle: '90 SFA Hilux DC 4X4, Full OME, 110mm lift. Brospeed branch, 50mm ss freeflow exhaust. 30 x 9.5 Discoverer S/T's on Viper mags. L/R tank. (AWOL) '98 LTD 2.4 SFA, dual battery system. Dobinson suspension, LR tanks, 31" BF mud's.
- Real Name: Andy
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
oom dan wrote:professional job steve are you going to fit a fan cowling, plenty off folks will be interested in the consumption figures, we have accepted our 22R for what it is, pap en dors
When your road comes to an end ...... you need a HILUX!.
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers ... what you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow.
Don't take life too seriously ..... no-one gets out alive.
It's not about waiting for storms to pass. It's about learning to dance in the rain.
And be yourself ..... everyone else is taken!
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- High Range 4WD
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- Vehicle: '96 Hilux Raider DC 4x4
- Real Name: Jacques
Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Zeppelin (Steve?)
It seems after much searching that this is the conversion I want to head to myself. Would you be willing/able/interested in some minor assistance/pointers/advice on the process? Also any recomendations on where to find the engine?
One question. You mentioned your motor came off an auto box and so you rather went the Dictator route. Would it be a better solution to look for a manual unit with ECU?
It seems after much searching that this is the conversion I want to head to myself. Would you be willing/able/interested in some minor assistance/pointers/advice on the process? Also any recomendations on where to find the engine?
One question. You mentioned your motor came off an auto box and so you rather went the Dictator route. Would it be a better solution to look for a manual unit with ECU?
- zepplin
- Monster Truck
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
No problem in sharing info.
You'll struggle to find one from a manual vehicle but if you find one with the ECU off an auto I'm sure you can get it to run.
You'll struggle to find one from a manual vehicle but if you find one with the ECU off an auto I'm sure you can get it to run.
Crooza VX 80 efi - fully locked.
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- High Range 4WD
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- Real Name: Jacques
Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Thanks
Now it may be a ball ache but there are two sets of infor I think would be handy:
1) What extras to buy:
radiator, hoses, rubbers, electricals etc.
2) What specific mods were needed:
Did you move engine mountings, which ones? The bellhousing adaptor plate - looks like a good plan - do you have the plate lineout or can you supply? Mods to the drive train (bearing changes, shaft lengthening etc). ECU setup and lastly getting that speedo to work!
Kinda a step by step process outline? I have worked on engines (my 22R I know well by now) but have never attemped a transplant.
If it's a bit too much do'nt worry, I know I am asking a lot and if needs be can figure things out - just though it may be easier to ask ;)
Now it may be a ball ache but there are two sets of infor I think would be handy:
1) What extras to buy:
radiator, hoses, rubbers, electricals etc.
2) What specific mods were needed:
Did you move engine mountings, which ones? The bellhousing adaptor plate - looks like a good plan - do you have the plate lineout or can you supply? Mods to the drive train (bearing changes, shaft lengthening etc). ECU setup and lastly getting that speedo to work!
Kinda a step by step process outline? I have worked on engines (my 22R I know well by now) but have never attemped a transplant.
If it's a bit too much do'nt worry, I know I am asking a lot and if needs be can figure things out - just though it may be easier to ask ;)
- zepplin
- Monster Truck
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Slowpoke wrote:1) What extras to buy:
radiator,I'm running a 2.4D aluminium radiator
hoses, Standard 22R heater & radiator hoses except top hose
rubbers,Married so don't use them
electricals,Nothing except fitting the Diktator management etc.
2) What specific mods were needed:
Did you move engine mountings, which ones?Moved the standard 22R engine mounts on the chassis rearwards. These had to be cut as they extend outwards too much for the 5VZ
The bellhousing adaptor plate - looks like a good plan - do you have the plate lineout or can you supply?
Had this professionaly made in Cape Town
Mods to the drive train (bearing changes, shaft lengthening etc).None. Standard 22R everything
ECU setup and lastly getting that speedo to work!Haven't touched the speedo & it works fine.
Kinda a step by step process outline? I have worked on engines (my 22R I know well by now) but have never attemped a transplant.My first one too. Removed old motor, did a couple of test fits to get the new one positioned, cut & welded the engine mounts, fitted management & did the exhaust. It was pretty painless once I had all the bits together.
Crooza VX 80 efi - fully locked.
- GeorgeJvR
- Monster Truck
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- Real Name: George
Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Did i miss the fuel consumption report?
To Buy and sell a vehicle is my hobby
Make a deal that no one else thought possible is my aim
Kom wat wil ek bly 'n Bul!
Make a deal that no one else thought possible is my aim
Kom wat wil ek bly 'n Bul!
- zepplin
- Monster Truck
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
The best I've recorded is 6.5km/l. Combination of 70% town & 30% highway @ 120km/h on 31's. There is so much torque available at the bottom I don't need to rev it past 3000 through the gears but at 120km/h the revs are sitting at 3400rpm which I could bring down a little with 33's. Very happy for the moment so that can wait. It's a little heavier on juice than the 22R but still struggling to keep the right foot from mis-behaving.
Crooza VX 80 efi - fully locked.
- GeorgeJvR
- Monster Truck
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- Real Name: George
Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Thanks
To Buy and sell a vehicle is my hobby
Make a deal that no one else thought possible is my aim
Kom wat wil ek bly 'n Bul!
Make a deal that no one else thought possible is my aim
Kom wat wil ek bly 'n Bul!
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- Monster Truck
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
6.5km/l... Steve that sounds about right! 33's will be great, but again they're going steal some more fuel!
- Stef
- Monster Truck
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
What did the 22R consume then? I'm currently getting just over 6km/l on mine; R500's worth of fuel from empty, then 300km to Heidelberg & back (including the trail) and the needle is sitting just above empty.
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- High Range 4WD
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Thanks Steve - good info to have as it influences the descisions.
On my 22R I get about 6.5km/l driving nicely. When I go hunting and I am in a hurry to get there doing 110 then I get closer to 5km/l. I stopped going 120 - too expensive.
On my 22R I get about 6.5km/l driving nicely. When I go hunting and I am in a hurry to get there doing 110 then I get closer to 5km/l. I stopped going 120 - too expensive.
- zepplin
- Monster Truck
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
I was getting around 7 km/l with the EFI and driving like my gran used to.Stef wrote:What did the 22R consume then?
Crooza VX 80 efi - fully locked.
- 96-Luxi 4x4
- LR 4WD Rear Locker
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
With all my extras and 33" BF's, I get between 5 and 4.5km/L
So bring on any conversion engine, cannot be worse than this, and then I have power!!
So bring on any conversion engine, cannot be worse than this, and then I have power!!
- Stef
- Monster Truck
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Then mine is not that bad The above figures were obtained while doing 120 -140 the morning and 110-120km/h back
- niclemaitre
- LR 4WD Full Lockers
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Don't suppose you'd feel like selling your EFI?
Happy trails
Nic
SFA '97 DC - affirmatively shopped
SFA '87 DC "Rooies" - sold
IFS '99 DC "Benny"
Nic
SFA '97 DC - affirmatively shopped
SFA '87 DC "Rooies" - sold
IFS '99 DC "Benny"
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- LR 4WD Rear Locker
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Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
steve im sure if you can get the rpm down to 2800 it should be a lot better on juice , the motor has enough low down torque so should be happy with it. even on 33,s , but for your first conversion give yourself a pat on the back it looks good.
- GeorgeJvR
- Monster Truck
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- Real Name: George
Re: 22R to 5VZ FE swap - Completed.
Will a KZ box bring the ratios down?
To Buy and sell a vehicle is my hobby
Make a deal that no one else thought possible is my aim
Kom wat wil ek bly 'n Bul!
Make a deal that no one else thought possible is my aim
Kom wat wil ek bly 'n Bul!