Temperature Rising

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Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

I set the timing on my lux this weekend, only to find this morning while driving with the aircon on the temperature rises and falls irratically.

Now I tried it with and without the aircon and it does the same thing.
I have checked the timing and it is set to +- 10 BTDC with vaccum pipes removed from the dizzy, idling at around 950 r/min.

This has now got me stumped, obviously the first thing that pops into mind is that the timing is wrong but I have checked and re-checked.

Any suggestions?
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Family_Dog »

Scott, is your engine modified to Brospeed specs? There is quite a large difference in timing between a standard 4Y and one that has been converted. The correct specs have been mentioned here before.


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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Riceburner »

Set your timing by ear, if it pings undr load retard it untill it stops. Never found a engine that you can set properly with a timing light.
Change your sender unit, mine messed me around for 6 weeks before replacing it wth a yota one.
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

Eric, thanks the standard 4Y is set to 5 or so and the brospeed to 10. :thumbup:

Ricey, it's easier said than done setting it by ear. :(

I found on the way to work this morning that under load the temperature seems to rise and then fall. It just gets to the danger zone and then drops down to normal and then gradually makes its way back up to the red.

Very strange.
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Umvubu »

My Lux temp also gave me alot of trouble. Decided this weekend to strip engine- Rebuilt - Test Radiator. I don't want to worry when it fails me between niks and nerens. :thumbup:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Ramkat »

Head gasket!
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

Head gasket was a thought on the way to work, but one thought I don't want. :thumbdown:

I will have to stop at silverton radiators and have a combustion test done, hopefully it will show me something. :(

It would really suck (as it has for alot of other guys) if it was to go. But I guess I have 283K on the clock, so might be time.
Perhaps the trail last weekend was the stone that broke the donkies back. :shock:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

I just went to check the cold engine, and tomy suprise all the water is gone. I checked it over the weekend and it was fine. :(
So it's looking like bad news for my 4Y. I will continue to hope that it is just a leak some where and not the HG.

Will have to fill up and check on the way home today.
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Dadz Toy BFI »

Scooter wrote:I just went to check the cold engine, and tomy suprise all the water is gone. I checked it over the weekend and it was fine. :(
So it's looking like bad news for my 4Y. I will continue to hope that it is just a leak some where and not the HG.

Will have to fill up and check on the way home today.

Have you checked for Mayonaise Scoots :?:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

Dadz Toy BFI wrote:Have you checked for Mayonaise Scoots :?:
:clap: :lol:

I just went to fill er up with water. I poured in around 3L (out of 7.4L that it takes). I let her run till warm and made sure that the thermostat opened. Closed up and let her run abit more. The temperature seemed to stay stable.

There is no mayonaise in the radiator Rich but I will keep a close eye on it. :lol:
I will remove the plugs after work and make sure they are not wet (although there is no misfire.)
Will also check the dipstick for mayonaise. :shock:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Dadz Toy BFI »

Scooter wrote:
Dadz Toy BFI wrote:Will also check the dipstick for mayonaise. :shock:

Run your finger inside the rocker cover and check out the oil consistency there :idea:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Knersus »

Dit it push back water into the ressorvoir tank or is it on the level. If it is full of water then the possibility is the head gasket is busy to give in. I surely hope it is a leak somewhere that can be fixed.
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

Knersus wrote:Dit it push back water into the ressorvoir tank or is it on the level. If it is full of water then the possibility is the head gasket is busy to give in. I surely hope it is a leak somewhere that can be fixed.
The resevoir was empty, so hopefully it is only a leak. Will check on arrival at home. Fingers crossed :wink:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Riceburner »

Try two bottles of Bars Leaks and a new sender unit.
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Knersus »

I am convinced that it is only a leak in the system. Let us know
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

Riceburner wrote:Try two bottles of Bars Leaks and a new sender unit.
I have never and doubt I ever will put that stuff in my car. I would rather strip it, find and cure the problem. :twisted:

After filling with water yesterday, it was fine all the way home and back to work this morning. I haven't found a leak yet but will see what happens after a few more days.
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Riceburner »

when last have you changed the water pump?
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

About 6 months ago IIRC. I will check it again, but i dont think it is leaking.
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Mr_B »

Hi Scooter,

The 4Y engine likes blowing between the cylinder and water jacket on no.4(outer edge). With time gasket eventually gets old and deformed. If this is the case you won't find oil in the coolant system(mayonnaise). What will happen is, as the super heated combustion gases get pumped into the water jacket, the temp gauge suddenly jumps high and then starts falling again quite quickly. To check this you must remove the radiator cap (when the engine is cold/cool) and start her up. Let the engine warm up to operating temp, blipping the throttle every now and then, and keep and eye on the water in the rad cap opening, if you see bubbles coming(minor hg blowing) up as it warms up or the water starts gushing out(major hg blow) then you know the hg is leaking. Then once the engine is at operating temp, check that the upper rad pipe(inlet to radiator) and rad lower(outlet to engine) are both warm(top one should be quite hot, bottom one warm, not cold). If the bottom remains cold even after the engine is at operating temp for quite a while(5-10 minutes) then either the thermostat is stuck closed or the water pump is stuffed...

B
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

Thanks Bretton, as I mentioned, with the radiator full now, the temperature is fine and doesn't climb past the middle of the gauge.
I have driven home and too work and nothing. That leads me to believe that it is a leak some where.

I would've thought that if it was the HG the water would be evaporated a lot quicker than with a leak. But I will check at lunch time how much water is missing after the two journeys.

I sure hope it's not the worst. I would be resorted to driving my dads porsche (dont get too excited, it's only a 924 T) if I had to strip the lux :shock: :lol:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Mr_B »

When my hg popped about 2 years ago I experienced similar symptons. Of course at that time I was not as wise about engine as I am now... one day after speaking to Allan about the fluctuating heat gauge... got home, opened the bonnet and proceded to remove the radiator cap very carefully... boom :shock: the radiator cap flew about 2 metres into the air... :? closely followed by a jet of water and super heated steam... :wth: fortunately I managed to get out of harms way just in time. :wink:

B
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by LouisZ »

Scott, take the Lux to Silverton Radiators that they test it, mine before the engine swop last year also had problems with eratic overheating, the cause was a half blocked & leaking radiator that eventually led to a engine replacement.

Better safe than sorry.
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

I think I will get to silvertons today after work.
The radiator is still full and the guage is not moving. Now while I would like to think it is sorted, experience and common sense tells me that the water had to go some where. It could not have just evaporated all of a sudden.

I will go get the rad checked and have a combustion test done just in case. But if it is blown on the 4th as Bretton suggests might be the case, then the combustion test, nor any other test, will show that and it might be worth it to strip the head and replace the gasket before the having to replace everything. :(
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Spook »

Scooter: I had disappearing water out of the radiator on my 4Y and in desperation I poured Spanjaard Pink radiator sealer in and this solved the problem...not by sealing it, but to show the pinhole in the heater pipe by making a pink spot against the outside of the engine! One cannot believe that such a small hole can lose so much water!
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by BenHur »

Scott if it is the HG blowing gas into the water system they do have a test for that that can test for combustion gas residue in the water, something like a PH test with colours changing indicating combustion gasses present in the water.

They can also pressurise the system which will show up leaks if any.
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Mr_B »

Scott, Bennie's right(ya as usual ne), any radiator place worth there salt has a combustion gas test kit!

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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Dadz Toy BFI »

Scott
Yeah I agree with Bretton

who agrees with Bennie who firstly agreed with Louise, who originally agreed with Knersus :think: :crazy: :shock:

that you should do that, that's if you agree :?

Agreed :P
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

I fully agree with all the agreeing thats been agreed upon.

I have done many combustion tests and pressure tests on vehicles personally and neither of them work all the time.
If the HG is not blown enough to allow enough co into the water then the colour of the liquid changes but not to the colour you would expect it to. The same can be said about a pressure test, it will show you that there is or isnt a leak but might not enable you to find that leak straight away if there is one.

That being said, I shall take it to silverton and see if they agree as we have all agreed :shock:

That being said for the second time, I refer to what I originally said:
Scooter wrote:I think I will get to silvertons today after work.
The radiator is still full and the guage is not moving. Now while I would like to think it is sorted, experience and common sense tells me that the water had to go some where. It could not have just evaporated all of a sudden.

I will go get the rad checked and have a combustion test done just in case. :(
Thanks for the assistance guys, i will try get there today and will keep you posted. Seems like alot of the SFA are getting to the age where heads start rolling. :wink:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Mr_B »

Agreed :lol:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Knersus »

Hopefully the damage is also agreeable :D The reason why toyota's blow their HG is due to the wrong antifreeze that people put in. Apparently it must be red one only :think:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Mr_B »

Oh cr@p mine is green and blue :shock:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by BenHur »

Oh no Bretton you pay R600 for a Payen gasket in Toyota packaging and then you go skimp on the coolant :thumbdown: :thumbdown:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Mr_B »

My coolant is Mobil @ R50/litre, there was no skimping involved!!! Mono-ethylene glycol all the way!
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by BenHur »

oppas ons hou jou dop :!: :!:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Knersus »

Bennie wat is die rede agter die Rooi coolant vir Toyota enjins :?: Ons het al die onderwerp iewers op die forum gehad oor watter anti freeze om te gebruik. Al wat ek weet 'n goeie toyota mach het vir my gese as dit nie die rooi een is nie, sal jy 'n goeie kans staan dat die HG gaan blaas. Tot dusver gebruik ek slegs die rooi op 'n toyota maar wat is die verskil regtig :!:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Dadz Toy BFI »

Worri nie, ethylene glycol is colourless - the colour is sommer nou cosmetic nê

Red, Blue, Green, pink all lekker by me :thumbup:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by King Rat »

The red Toyota anti-freeze is pre-mixed already, no need to add water as this will change the effectiveness of it.
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Scooter »

YIPPEEE :!: Found the problem and it wasn't the HG.

I pressure tested the sytem and found that the pipe running over the cam cover from the inlet manifold to something on the other side :shock: was old and brittle and therefore cracked and leaking. Replaced it and it should solve the problem.

Built a pressure tester, will post now.
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Dadz Toy BFI »

Scooter wrote:YIPPEEE :!: Found the problem and it wasn't the HG.

I pressure tested the sytem and found that the pipe running over the cam cover from the inlet manifold to something on the other side :shock: was old and brittle and therefore cracked and leaking. Replaced it and it should solve the problem.

Built a pressure tester, will post now.
Great News :thumbup:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by ThysdJ »

yeah :twisted: :thumbup: :thumbup:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by LouisZ »

Good To Hear!! :clap:
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Re: Temperature Rising

Post by Mr_B »

Yeah! Now you can rather splash out on something else... new suspension?? 33 tyres?? diffloc??
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