Hilux 4x4 Forum

Hi I am new to the forum. I have a 96 model double cab
With a 22r which I made fuel injection and turbocharged l always wanted to fit a 3RZ turbo moter in it. Ok I have the 3RZ and is starting to do planning. My question is the 3RZ sit on a angle for vibration and to help with oil return. I am going to remove the balancer shafts but was wondering can I mound the moter level. I looked at the returns and they are equally spaced. Any help would be appreciated.

Poffie wrote:Hi I am new to the forum. I have a 96 model double cab
With a 22r which I made fuel injection and turbocharged l always wanted to fit a 3RZ turbo moter in it. Ok I have the 3RZ and is starting to do planning. My question is the 3RZ sit on a angle for vibration and to help with oil return. I am going to remove the balancer shafts but was wondering can I mound the moter level. I looked at the returns and they are equally spaced. Any help would be appreciated.

Good day will you be selling the 22R engine or the fuel injection with management system would be interested in purchasing regards

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Hi one of my friends is nagging me about the engine he has first option. I am still using it as we speak. I’m busy building a new stainless turbo manifold as the old one has served me well it lasted four years. I will definitely contact you if he is not interested anymore.

Good day Charl any pics you can send of your 22r turbo engine please, and what turbo you are running and injectors head gasket,boost power and fuel consumption ect

Good day thanks getting back to me please let me know if your friend does not take the engine
Sorry for the late response was travelling today
Regards Minesh

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I will try and post some pics I have never done it before. As for the moter it is a standard 22r. I have dropped the compression to 8,5 to one. I have flowed the head double valve springs. The turbo is a concoction of allot of experimentation. The intake I have made myself it works very well. As for injectors I have 550cc but it is a bit of a overkill. I was running it for years on 0.5bar and later on 0,8bar. As for fuel economy I really don’t know it is heavy for sure but I am almost always towing my boat or we go play allot. My main objective was to build a moter that was already heavy on fuel and underpowered into a strong reliable and affordable vehicle that I can enjoy.

Thanks will be very nice to see I have two 22R motors one in the current vehicle and a spare unit..I prefer them to the 4y more power if you have a moment you can send me your pics and info to 0828200130 i will really appreciate all the information you can send..regards

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I will forward you some videos and pictures

Poffie wrote: ↑Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:56 pm I will try and post some pics I have never done it before. As for the moter it is a standard 22r. I have dropped the compression to 8,5 to one. I have flowed the head double valve springs. The turbo is a concoction of allot of experimentation. The intake I have made myself it works very well. As for injectors I have 550cc but it is a bit of a overkill. I was running it for years on 0.5bar and later on 0,8bar. As for fuel economy I really don’t know it is heavy for sure but I am almost always towing my boat or we go play allot. My main objective was to build a moter that was already heavy on fuel and underpowered into a strong reliable and affordable vehicle that I can enjoy.

Good day Poffie

Did you use the standard conrods on the low compression pistons or stronger ones?

The reason I ask is that I have a 4Y and want to install a turbo for that little extra oomph and I heard guys say they used a 0.5 bar supercharger on the stock motor and it was reliable. I don’t think the stock internals can handle 0.5 bar for long.
I was thinking 0.2 bar just not to lag on inclines.

Suggest you rather consider an EFI conversion to the 2200. It made a world of difference to Bulldog!

See topic viewtopic.php?f=92&t=1172


-F_D

You can squeeze extra horses out of any motor by doing "upgrades" / modifications but the truth is that the reliability / longevity of the motor is compromised as a result. The 4Y was never intended to be turbo'd or supercharged.

An EFI conversion provides a little improvement without any negative effects. If you stay with the carb, just make sure it's properly set up (also timing) and that the air filter is clean and unrestricted.

Hi Bear I suggest that you fit a EFI first. When you want to turbo your bakkie you have to have EFI. As for turbocharging it is not worth the effort and money to boost 0,2 bar. Fit the EFI first then if you want to turbo or supercharge or swap to a different engine you already have EFI.

I’m not sure if I want to EFI. Some say it makes little difference and others say a big difference.

A 2200 motor should not lag on inclines the way the 4Y does. I know the gear ratios are not so much for road but still it should give better power. Not sure if it is because of the carb being too small.

If there is only a little difference after EFI, than I think it is not worth the costs.

If it is a quite a significant difference than I would do it. All those who have EFI on their 4Y's may comment.

Then I would like to go individual throttle bodies (just like side drafts).
One of the secrets to good torque and power is to get the engine to breath best as possible.
I would gas flow the heads while enlarging the internal air ways a bit (professionally on a flow bench), port the head to inlet and exhaust manifolds, bigger valves, cut the cam mildly for low end torque with a 4 into 1 branch. I know Cowley branches were good, not sure if they still make them for the 4Y.
Basically that’s racing car specs. Just not raising the compression ratio.

Just this process will cost a bit, but if EFI provides a significant difference to power and torque then I would like to go all the way as above.

Many may say, if you going to pay so much than change the engine to Lexus, etc.

I prefer the 4Y, our taxi industry has proven its worth.

EFI is definitely not going to make that huge difference but what it will do is make your vehicle very drivable when off-roading. It would not have problems with bogging and stuttering on very steep inclines. Also if you’re thinking throttle bodies you still need EFI. On the branch side a four into two into one branch is better for engine with long stroke. It gives better torque. I saw a 4y on a dyno with side draft carbs and branch it made 92kw on a normal bakkie. I will not recommend sidies on a4x4. They need constant TLC

EFI does indeed make a most worthwhile improvement to a 2200's performance. Bulldog was always hesitant on inclines but since the conversion, I no longer need to drop a gear on the slightest incline. Fuel performance is slightly improved at around 6.5 - 7.5 km/litre. When I had the original Nikki Carb and even after fitting a Weber carb, fuel consumption was closer to 5 - 6km/litre.

The 2200 feels much happier cruising at 120km/hr on the open road than before the conversion. This is more or less true speed confirmed with a GPS after having fitted 31" mud tyres.

Performance is not rocket speed by any means but the vehicle is so much more pleasant to drive and just "feels right" since the conversion. I would always recommend it, anytime!


-F_D

Dug up where I had posted the Dyno Chart after the conversion, there might be other charts stored there from which you can draw comparisons.

viewtopic.php?p=31276#p31276


-F_D

Family_Dog wrote: ↑Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:31 pm Dug up where I had posted the Dyno Chart after the conversion, there might be other charts stored there from which you can draw comparisons.

viewtopic.php?p=31276#p31276


-F_D

One of the comments by Bennie (BenHur)
“Everyone driving a 4Y Donkey eat your hard out. JohanM's 4Y did 90.1HP on his Dynorun today. The Air reading temp was 31 compared to 37 (IIRC) when we did Bulldog and Louis was in that region too.”

90.1 HP = 66.3 kilowatts

The 4Y engine does 70KW… confused there!

Poffie wrote: ↑Thu Sep 26, 2019 5:10 pm EFI is definitely not going to make that huge difference but what it will do is make your vehicle very drivable when off-roading. It would not have problems with bogging and stuttering on very steep inclines. Also if you’re thinking throttle bodies you still need EFI. On the branch side a four into two into one branch is better for engine with long stroke. It gives better torque. I saw a 4y on a dyno with side draft carbs and branch it made 92kw on a normal bakkie. I will not recommend sidies on a4x4. They need constant TLC

I am not an experienced off-roader and I don't do competitions etc. If I had a spare 4x4 I certainly would like to do that. I like Mountain passes – Sani pass, Swartberg Pass. Richtersveld, Drakensberg, just good scenic places out in the bush, etc. Will I experience the steep inclines which you speak of in those scenarios?

The individual throttle bodies will be EFI. The Toyota Corolla 20v uses them as stock.

On the branch from my experience, the 4 into 2 into 1 is more for midrange to top end torque.
The 4 into 1 is for low rev torque or take of power. On the quarter mile drag the 4 into 1 is preferred.
On the 4x4 most of the torque is required at low revs.
Don’t get me wrong, I am not arguing with you, just giving input from my knowledge and experience in race car modifications.

When you say 92kw gain on a 4y with just side drafts and a branch – those are impressive figures if those were the only conversions. Then it will be worth installing individual throttle bodies with EFI.
I would not want to strip a good engine, but bumping up the compression ratio should take it close to 100kw.

Family_Dog wrote: ↑Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:21 pm EFI does indeed make a most worthwhile improvement to a 2200's performance. Bulldog was always hesitant on inclines but since the conversion, I no longer need to drop a gear on the slightest incline. Fuel performance is slightly improved at around 6.5 - 7.5 km/litre. When I had the original Nikki Carb and even after fitting a Weber carb, fuel consumption was closer to 5 - 6km/litre.

The 2200 feels much happier cruising at 120km/hr on the open road than before the conversion. This is more or less true speed confirmed with a GPS after having fitted 31" mud tyres.

Performance is not rocket speed by any means but the vehicle is so much more pleasant to drive and just "feels right" since the conversion. I would always recommend it, anytime!

-F_D

You state “The 2200 feels much happier cruising at 120km/hr on the open road”
Does it exceed 120km/h also being happy or is that about the limit?

“Performance is not rocket speed by any means but the vehicle is so much more pleasant to drive and just "feels right" since the conversion.”
I understand what you saying and said quite well.

“I would always recommend it, anytime!”
So you saying its worth investing the millions $$$$ into EFI …

Hi guys is there any one that did a 3RZ conversion in the SFA that can give me some information. Thank you .

Bear wrote: ↑Fri Sep 27, 2019 6:09 pm
You state “The 2200 feels much happier cruising at 120km/hr on the open road”
Does it exceed 120km/h also being happy or is that about the limit?

“Performance is not rocket speed by any means but the vehicle is so much more pleasant to drive and just "feels right" since the conversion.”
I understand what you saying and said quite well.

“I would always recommend it, anytime!”
So you saying its worth investing the millions $$$$ into EFI …

It can exceed 120, can't remember just how fast I have had it, probably somewhere between 130-140km/hr. But then it no longer feels a happy medium and I felt much more comfortable at driving around 120km/hr. That Hilux DC is not built for high speeds!

No idea what it would cost now, but at the time I was very happy with the conversion and costs then were not astronomical. There is also no extra strain on the engine, such as would be with a turbo conversion.

There is an excellent Indie near you, Ralph, can't recall their trading name but Toyo or something similar. Might be worthwhile looking him up and chatting with him.

-F_D

I did a 3RZ swap in my SFA and it works a treat. Was my only wheels for 5 years. Mounted the engine angled, mainly for the oil levels, engine and gearboxes!! Done about 160k km on the conversion with no issues. Now that its my weekend warrior Im also keen for a turbo, but its going to be tight to fit a Turbo and intercooler without doing some major surgery.

Please keep us updated on your conversion.

O yes, did I mention my dad also did a 3RZ conversion. Just a perfect combination.


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Bear wrote: ↑Fri Sep 27, 2019 5:20 pm

Family_Dog wrote: ↑Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:31 pm Dug up where I had posted the Dyno Chart after the conversion, there might be other charts stored there from which you can draw comparisons.

viewtopic.php?p=31276#p31276


-F_D

One of the comments by Bennie (BenHur)
“Everyone driving a 4Y Donkey eat your hard out. JohanM's 4Y did 90.1HP on his Dynorun today. The Air reading temp was 31 compared to 37 (IIRC) when we did Bulldog and Louis was in that region too.”

90.1 HP = 66.3 kilowatts

The 4Y engine does 70KW… confused there!

Its 70kW on the Flywheel. The 66.3kW on Johan's on the rear wheels.

Thanks Louis for the clarity.

Thank for the information Riaan good to hear I will see about the angel of the engine when I get there. If the gearbox and bell housing allow me to mount it straight up l will do so. I am going to make the sump bigger for more oil capacity. However if it is going to be a mission I will keep it slanted. Space is not really a problem if you can custom make the manifolds to make better use of the space. One other small problem is that the exhaust is on the other side. That means I have to move my fuel lines and I have to see how to route the exhaust but I will cross that bridge when I get there. For now I starting with prepping the engine

Hi Charl

No info for you on the 3RZ sorry.
But i would love some details on your 22RET setup as i am planing to do a .3/.4 boost on my 22RE motor currently 5/6Km/l
As my foot is very heavy to wake up some horses......

You can contact me on zero82 4one9 2359

GeorgeJvR wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2019 8:04 am
But i would love some details on your 22RET setup as i am planing to do a .3/.4 boost on my 22RE motor currently 5/6Km/l
As my foot is very heavy to wake up some horses......

Hi George
Consult some professionals regarding the turbo set up on the 22RE. The 22RE has (78 kW) and a higher compression ratio than the overseas, 22RTE which has (101 kW) and compression ratio of 7.5:1. Running a 3 / 4 bar boost with stock pistons and conrods will damage the engine eventually.

People may have claimed to have done it. Sure the motor runs, but for how long?

I’ve seen guys doing conversions, and then 4 to 6 months later the bottom end of the engine breaks and you’ll be lucky to salvage the block thereafter.
Mainly the conrods give in. Strenghtened ones need to be installed.

[/quote]

Hi George
Consult some professionals regarding the turbo set up on the 22RE. The 22RE has (78 kW) and a higher compression ratio than the overseas, 22RTE which has (101 kW) and compression ratio of 7.5:1. Running a 3 / 4 bar boost with stock pistons and conrods will damage the engine eventually.

People may have claimed to have done it. Sure the motor runs, but for how long?

I’ve seen guys doing conversions, and then 4 to 6 months later the bottom end of the engine breaks and you’ll be lucky to salvage the block thereafter.
Mainly the conrods give in. Strenghtened ones need to be installed.
[/quote]

Jip Planing on doing it the right way first time

I can not speak for any other person or entity when it comes to modifying. I can however tell you about my experience and can give you the information you need regarding turbocharged 22RE. Firstly I will speak for myself.My bakkie has been running for 10 years with a turbo. I first made it EFI by building my own intake manifold that made a huge difference as the 22re standard manifolds works good at low rpm. I am always towing boat or other vehicles and wanted more power when cruising at 3000rpm. I first did the whole conversation to my stock standard engine. I was boosting 0,5bar for about three years without any engine related problems. I have changed turbos a couple of times to get my setup right for my application. The block and internals of the 22r is very strong the crank and block is good for insane power. The pistons is not the best but if the engine is tuned properly you don’t have to go for forged pistons. If you keep your boost under 0,5bar and you have reliable instruments like A/F ratio and a good pyrometer you can get away with murder. My bakkie is not a toy to show off or impress anyone I drive it every day. Most of the time it is always towing something. When I started playing with the 22r I did ALOT of research the problem is that overseas they just put a other engine in or do conversions with bolt on parts. What I can say is I don’t have any reliability problems I don’t drive like a maniac except when we play. I have broken three side shafts I have broken third gear ones but it was my fault. I have build a new engine two years ago I again used pirate pistons and parts. I dropped the compression ratio to 8.5:1 I boost it 0,8bar now and have done 35000km and no problems. I have made a new stainless steel turbo manifold after 10 years my steam pipe manifold was vrot. So that is my story.

Thanks Charl

I'm considering CC DYNO for my motor's build.

If you need any advice I am happy to help good luck you will not be disappointed it is nice to have double the power.

Thanks Charl